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| Guru Q1 has a point. In the beginning the card game itself was a novelty with basic rules and regulations. Now its more than that like "as damage goes on the stack" or "at the end of your turn" or "during your upkeep" rules that are confusing by themselves as it is. We'll just have to hope it works to a good advantage. | I am happy to say that I am one of the lucky beta play testers. I am so addicted to this game that I find myself drafting at 3:00 am on a regular workday.
There are about 500 play testers and I would say the approval rating is over 90% from these players, which includes a high number of Pro-Tour players.
This will not replace Apprentice, but will attract a new core of magic online players. The only thing you people have to worry about is getting addicted to the game, and getting by on couple of hours of sleep. | I have seen the Alpha-version, it's very playable and cool and the best thing since sliced bread but...
There is only one thing bugging me: "players will be able to purchase digital cards".
I WILL NOT PAY NOTHING MORE THAN THE INITIAL PRICE OF THE GAME. I already dispise every online game that charges by monthly rate in addition to the price of the game.
The only way I would agree to it if the price would be something like 3$ = 36 digital packs since they don't cost ANYTHING for WotC to create. The real cards have to be shipped and printed, so there are costs. Here there are none since I guess that all the development costs will be charged in the game itself.
If they are going to charge something like 40$ for the game and you get something like one box of cards with that and 1$ for each pack after that then you wont see me online. I'll stick to NetDraft and Apprentice. All I can say that this maybe a potential RIPOFF.
Over and Out. | | Does anyone know when and where they'll be taking applications for the beta test? Not that I'm interested or anything... ;-) | | So go ahead and tell us what kinda security measures are going to be taken against online hackers modifying databases and records of the winning players, or someone building software that will enable them to make a complete set of digital cards? Read my previous article titled "HACKERS" | | I have idea, when we purchase 1 REAL BOOSTER CARD we recive 1 "password" inside it where we can change with 1 VIRTUAL BOOSTER CARD, How about it ? | Call me a weirdo but I actually enjoy going to the card shops and tournaments, sitting down across from a human being and playing a match with them. I enjoy the game. The conversation. The random things that happen during a game.
I do use apprentice but it's usually just to play test a deck before I go and buy/ trade for all the real cards I need for the deck. I myself wouldn't pay money for online cards or a monthly fee. I'd rather use the money for gas and drive to the card shops and play real opponents. If they are trying to make money off online play why not just charge $40 for the game itself, is wizards that greedy?
Just my two cents worth....
Stewballs | Great Idea:
"I have idea, when we purchase 1 REAL BOOSTER CARD we recive 1 "password" inside it where we can change with 1 VIRTUAL BOOSTER CARD, How about it?" | What is up with this?! Buying cards online!? I agree with previous posts in that selling 'virtual'cards through the game will totaly defeat the fact of buying the program.
I like the point system that someone mentioned earlier. 'Battle.net' is a free online gameplay for 'Starcraft'. Why can't it be like this? "For money?" some may ask.
Well if you ask me, they won't be getting jack from me if the virtual cards cost anything. Apprentice will be my default until they staighten this out. | While some people show a hesitation to buy virtual cards, I would like to point out that several online CCGs already exist, where you purchase Virtual Cards. Games such as Sanctum (sanctum.nioga.net) or ChronX (www.chronx.com) have been in business, online, for more than 3 years. The ability to find a person to play with, 24hrs a day, 7 days a week is great. The fact that you can manage your deck collection without having to sort through boxes of cards is great. Not having to worry about sleeving cards is great. Virtual cards take up zero space, can be 'transported' from PC to PC (method varies by online game, but I know that Sanctum retains a record of all your cards on their servers, so you can load the game anywhere and never have to worry about saving your collection to disc, etc)
The only risk I foresee is if the virtual game goes out of business.. The orinal creators of Sanctum had this problem until a group of players stepped up, bought the game and kept it online during the entire process.. keeping the game alive, the value of the cards alive, etc. (Yes, virtual cards can have value.. there are some Sanctum cards that go for $40+, although most rares can be had for between $1-3)
So, before saying Virtual cards will never work, check out some of the online games that prove they can work.
And yes, I am associated with Sanctum, so I have bias, but to be fair I listed a competitors product as well..
-Grok
Try Sanctum: 60 card starter decks always free! (sanctum.nioga.net) | Ack, silly forum doesn't like dollar values.
Some Sanctum cards range go for as much as 40 dollars each, while most rares are between 1 and 3 dollars each.
As to those who fear hackers, server crashes, etc, the solution is simple. Multiple servers sharing the data and doing a check of each account before play.
-Grok | I've been involved with [link="http://sanctum.nioga.net/"]Sanctum[/link] for some time, an existing online CCG, basically. So any online CCG is pretty interesting to me (just to admit my biases up front).
I like Magic the Gathering a lot. I would love to be able to play Magic competitively without having to travel all over the world. (The traveling is fine; the cost is not.)
[b]Buy The Whole thing Once: Good for players, probably bad for Wizards[/b]
If this is a buy-once play-forever deal, they'll sell a zillion copies (with no more revenue in the future). I doubt it.
[b]Monthly Subscription: Good for everyone?[/b]
If this is a relatively cheap monthly subscription which allows you to play EVERYTHING (Type II with all cards, drafting, etc.) then I think they would get a lot of people, and basically have a good online everygreen source. I think this would also attract a lot of people who WILl continue to buy real cards.
[b]Buying the game, AND packs twice: Two Communities, and huge support necessary[/b]
I would personally be wary of having to pay for all my Magic cards *twice* (online and offline). I would probably just pick one, and not use the other at all. (If this is REALLY cool, and well supported, then I might just stop buying real packs and play ONLY online.) I'm sure that *very* few people would be willing to spend twice as much on Magic.
I suspect that most players would pick one. If not enough players want to play online, then the online game will just die. Wizards MIGHT end up just transferring some existing Magic players online, thereby gaining little revenue. (However, there surely ARE some people who would only play online, and not offline, so the long run might be much better revenue ... once the development costs are recouped.)
If this is a buy-packs-just-like-real-cards (and similar to Sanctum, except for the real-life cards), then Wizards will need to have some truly great support for this product. i.e.: They'll need to support tournaments, with REAL prizes -- probably CASH prizes. They'll need to have many weekly drafts (or anytime-drafts, if that works out), etc.
In short, I think Wizards will need to have nearly everything in the online version that exists in the offline version (and this is without the support of gaming stores, who run MOST Magic events today).
As a Sanctum employee, I sincerely hope that Wizards and Leaping Lizards produce a solid product. I wish them the best.
Personally, I hope I can get rich by playing Magic online. | | Calm down people, there is no reason to get all in a twist. The game is awesome and nearly every complaint on this thread is totaly unfounded. Just wait for official announcements about the game details and you will be pleased. The other testers that posted already are right, the game is fun and addictive and I'll be in line waiting to buy it when it hits the shelves. | I broke as it is. What happens if I can't afford the 'low monthly fee'? To they take it out of your card base, or just not allow you to use the cards you bought? Something doesn't fit here...
I know what all of you nice optomists are thinkin': 'what if there isn't a monthly charge?' Do you really think WotC will make gameplay less than usual? It costs lotsa cash to keep a complex online site running, esp. with all the cards and players and decks.
Then, when it collaspes, there will be no refunds. And it is only as good as the reg. version, without all the fun of jokes, cursing, and junk food.
No way am I buying into this fad. I don't have enough cash to spend on MtG cards as is. | | Someone mentioned this earlier, but it's worth repeating...is there going to be a Mac version? Is the program written in Java or something that is cross-platform compatible? There are a lot of Mac users out here who play Magic, and they are consistently left out. It is not that difficult to port a game like this to the Mac, and especially now that MacOS X has Unix underpinnings, it is easier than ever. I spend a lot of money on Magic, a lot of time playing it, and would love a virtual resource...alas, I am not willing to give up superior processing power, better value and more stable and innovative features in order to play this one game online, simply because Wizards refuses to spend the extra couple bucks to port the game. | | I'm pretty sure that you don't have to spend money on cards for this. You get an assigned amount of credit and you can buy one "pack" for 1 point. You start out with like 90 and get more every once in a while or when you win tournaments | | If I have to spend $ on virtual cards then forget it maybe you get points for winning and with these points you prolly can get cards | Paying a monthly fee (10 bucks, max.) to play on line won't be the game's death knell. Dozens of games already do that, and they've thrived on it. But, If players are forced to buy "virtual" boosters to play online, this game will have a lifespan of 6 months. Max.
Ideally, once you buy the game, you should have access to all available sets from 7th edition and up. This way here, you can play type 2 without any extra costs above and beyond the monthly fee. However, I can see paying for drafts and/or sealed deck tournaments. You have to pay for them in real life, so I don't see much difference charging for on line sealed tournaments. Sponsored t2 tournaments could charge an admission fee, just like regular tournaments. However, casual t2 play should be free, with all cards available to all players.
Prizes for tournaments should consist of virtual versions of non-t2 cards, such as extended goodies like Morphlings and duals for smaller tournaments, and type one goodies like Mana Drains, Moxes, etc, for higher level tournaments. This would make the Online Trading segment worthwhile, and give people something to play for. Want to play those Moxes on line? Gotta damn well earn them.
One problem that has plagued EVERY on line game I've EVER heard of in my life is hackers. You're a fool if you don't think someone will find a way to expand their card pool exponentially, gain access to others' accounts, rig the rules, etc. It's happened to every other game out there, and I'll bet that a dozen cracks will be available within 6 weeks of release.
Given the fact that, as it currently stands, you're going to be investing real money to expand your available card pool, keep up your on line ranking, etc., one MAJOR target for hackers is going to be WotC's servers. Think of the amount of money players will lose if, as one person alluded to, a hacker erases their main servers, forcing them to load from even one day old backups. WotC will be legally responsible for the amount of money players will have lost due to this, and it'll cost them thousands in lost revenues, software patching, legal fees, reimbursements, etc. They'd better have some damn good security measures, for their sake.
All in all, it's a great idea in theory. However, I could drive my car through all the large holes in it's implementation. | [quote]Think of the amount of money players will lose if, as one person alluded to, a hacker erases their main servers, forcing them to load from even one day old backups.[/quote]I think this is the main reason most online game have stuck with a subscription fee rather than selling in-game items for cash. If they sell you a Finkel for 20 bucks and it goes missing due to hacking or a bug, they would probably be responsible for replacing it. Verant (the EverQuest company) even forbids selling from player to player on eBay, so they can justify the claim that in-game items have no value in real life money.
One idea would be having a league where you play with cards given at the start of the game, trade cards and win boosters, without being forced to use only those cards in normal sanctioned tourneys. Winning and trading cards is a good idea, having the option of buying them would probably be unbalancing in such a league. | what i dont understand, why would buy "nothing"?
with the real cards it gives you the idea you own something.
same with mp3, i dont want to pay for my mp3, if i pay, i want a tape or cd?
and i dont think they can make this work.
nothing beats the sheer romance of coming together in the basement of a gamestore in town.
with all these people that are so different but are connected just by playing MTG.
the romance of stepping into a plane that takes you to a foreign country where people from all over the world come together to do what they love most.
you can not digitalize that. | | As many of you know, when that game came out, they trumpited...FREE Online for life, but that wasn't the case for TEN. I for one, am worried more about the game freezing during play or my oppenent dis-connecting if losing. IMO they have to have a montly fee or it will never survive. I for one would pay for online cards, I enjoy sitting at home, listening to some music and relaxing. I would never pay the same as the boosters or boxes are at stores, but if they were comparable, then I would. Just putting my 2 cents | | I quit playing magic a couple years ago. I have no time for tournaments, and I was always a casual player to begin with. The reason I've stayed out of the game is simple, too much money for little pieces of cardboard. If you don't have some grand scheme of winning tournaments (and how many of you have every won even half the money you've spent), this game is just a whole lot of money for nothing. If I just really like the game, I could even make my own cards to play with my friends. This online version has me interested, but if Wizards thinks they can drain money from me online as though I was playing in real life, then forget magic. If I'm not willing to put the money into the real versions of my old T1 favorites (REAL magic, that), why would I want to spend money on ethereal cards, and only NEW cards at that? Do whatever you want to get money from tournament players, but don't forget that casual people play too. What do casual players want? The entire vast cardpool to create our dream decks, and we certainly don't want to hemmorhage money into an online game if we're not willing to do it in real life. I'm sure I'll be lambasted for this, I forget that all of magic turned 'pro' somewhere around '99. | if they are gonna make me pay per month, no way. Ever. Ever.
It is just not worth it in the overall picture. Wizards is just trying to hitch a ride on the "gravy train" of online games. They think they can transfer it over and it will be a success. I think it will fail. Not horribly. But slowly. People will like it at first, but eventually, people will stop playing it online, it will lose money, and online play will shut down. It will go the way of the dinosaurs, furbies, pogs, marbles, every other fad you can think of.
do YOU like virtual cards? Do you like 0101101110s instead of a real card? Will it feel the same when you colelct the last card in a set online, compared to that last card in real life, which is real matter? Which you can use outta that little gray box you call a computer?
I'm on a rant here, but I think Magic is just the way it is, it does not need to be turned into an online game like sanctum. The key is fun, I don't know about you, but I don't find paying for virtual "packs" fun. | Ok i see quite a number of problems with this game, most which have been touched on already.
No, I don't think people will want to pay real money for virtual cards.
No, If people have to buy boosters to get the cards they want to build the decks they want even just to test, this wont succeed.
No, I don't think its a good idea to incorporate any kind of actual money into the playing of this game other than an initial purchase cost, because people will hack this game.( I don't doubt about that)
this could lean to innumerable problems.
Yes, I do think the game will sell if people can build any decks they want without having to purchase virtual cards, so they can test out decks and play friendly games, while they will charge for people to play in tournaments though.
Just my 2 cents. | | THERE WILL BE NO PRICE FOR VIRTUAL CARDS PERIOD. I know this for a fact because my friend is an alpha tester (I hope WoTC doesnt track me down heh) and he has told me about it. You get points from winning and stuff and you spend them on "buying" virtual packs. From what he said its not too hard to get alot of good cards |
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